Zar Amir, already awarded at the Cannes Film Festival for "Holy Spider," returns with this daring project where collaboration between an Iranian and an Israeli transcends political tensions. In "Tatami," co-directed by Zar Amir Ebrahimi and Guy Nattiv, the struggle of an Iranian judoka to achieve her dream under the pressure of an oppressive regime resonates powerfully. Zar Amir reveals the behind-the-scenes of this captivating work, a powerful testimony of resistance and sisterhood against oppression, born from her commitment to women's rights, both in Iran and worldwide. In 2022, Zar Amir was listed among the BBC's 100 Women as one of the most inspiring and influential women in the world. The Iranian co-director of "Tatami," a historic collaboration with Israeli Guy Nattiv, Zar Amir has lived in Paris since March 2008, after fleeing Iran following the publication of a video with her boyfriend that put her life in danger. Exiled in Paris, she learned French and worked various jobs. Zar Amir persevered to become a producer for BBC World and was awarded at the Cannes Film Festival in 2022 for her role in Ali Abbasi's "Holy Spider". Revealed through her acting career, Zar Amir has always had a passion for directing. As a young woman, she directed a short film, Khat, and then worked in every position on a film set. She always wanted to direct films, and it was ultimately through casting that she signed on to direct this film. Proof that she was right to follow the advice of her neighbor, a great Iranian director… Actress, producer, and director, Zar Amir continues to push boundaries. This time, she worked alongside Israeli director Guy Nattiv, first chosen for the casting, then for co-directing. A historic collaboration between two official enemy countries, yet whose peoples share the same love of freedom and life.
Interview conducted in tandem at a roundtable with Jérémy Chommanivong of “Le Mag du Ciné.”
We met a smiling actress and director, dressed all in green on the beautiful terrace of Metropolitan Films.
Movieintheair: I had seen "Holy Spider", which I loved. Then I saw "Tatami," which is also a very powerful film. My first question is: why did you want to become an actress and then a director? Did you feel early on that becoming an actress was a way to play with the rules of society? Zar Amir: It’s a bit the other way around. The first thing I did in my career was to direct a short film at 18 (Khat). Before that, I did some assistant work, script supervising. I wanted to become a director. Then, it was after the advice of a great Iranian director who was my neighbor. He told me, “If you want to become a good director, you need to learn how to act. All the technical stuff, you can learn on the job, but you will never know how to direct an actor without understanding their craft.” It was really the best advice of my life, and I continued my acting studies in Iran. I immediately fell in love with acting, which allows you to truly live different lives, to embody varied characters, and I started working as an actress. But I continued working on projects behind the camera. Then there’s my whole story of exile that forced me to stay behind the camera for years. When I arrived in France, I didn’t speak French, and I had no network. So I did quite a few documentaries, started filming, working as a camerawoman, editor, producer. And then, I resumed my acting career. It was a bit difficult at first because just acting bores me, but just directing also bores me. Directing, for me, is capturing a whole world that fascinates me. Sometimes I miss filming, even being a camerawoman, because it fascinates me. It’s really all aspects of cinema that interest me. Le Mag du Ciné: So it must have pleased you that Guy Nattiv asked you to co-direct with him? What were the writing steps you went through together? Where did you start? Zar Amir: For me, it all started with an organic casting request. It was before the release and Cannes for the film "Holy Spider" We then met in Los Angeles during the American release of "Holy Spider". Guy came to see the film, he loved it, and offered me the role of Maryam. We talked a lot about it. The script was already written by Guy and his collaborator Elham Erfani, an Iranian screenwriter living in France. The script was strong, and I knew this story absolutely needed to be told. I was familiar with the subject, having athlete friends who had similar experiences, but something was missing in the character of Maryam, the coach of Arienne. She wasn’t deep enough, she lacked presence. What I told Guy is that this film is above all the confrontation of two generations and how each reacts to a totalitarian state. We see how Maryam, who was betrayed, is hurt, and how Leila, this new determined youth, finds inspiration in her. I asked for a rewrite of this character. I did it with Elham (Elham Erfani), and we worked together a lot. Then, I also did the casting. I was already the casting director on "Holy Spider" when Ali Abbasi offered me the role. Arienne was already attached to the project. In the end, I gave so much feedback on everything that one day, Guy said to me, “I don’t feel legitimate to make this film alone. Come, let’s direct it together.” But I took some time to think about it, because of the tensions between Iran and Israel, with all the judgments that could follow… I took my time to be sure of what I wanted to do. I talked a lot with Guy to be sure of his vision, his politics, the story he wanted to tell. I watched all his films. Once I was sure of the artistic quality of the film, I really left all my fears behind me. And I’m so happy to have made this film because it was really a beautiful collaboration, this historic collaboration is a strong message. Movieintheair: On the set, there was an athlete, an Iranian boxer named Sadaf Khadem who was a consultant because she lived through what the character experienced. How did she contribute to your writing? Were you always in agreement? Zar Amir: I wasn’t there during the writing, but I know the story is inspired by many athletes' stories. She is the first Iranian female boxer to win medals, and she removed her veil. She faced many problems when she wanted to return to Iran at the time. It was in 2019, I think. So she stayed in France. Yes, she was a consultant on the film, but mostly to build this universe of athletes, those who face danger, the risks they take. This film was also a part of her own life.
“Tatami is not only inspired by Iranians but also by refugees from around the world.”
Movieintheair: How did you experience the Olympics this summer, as it had a strong resonance with the film? We saw, for example, an Israeli athlete left alone because the Algerian refused to compete against him…? Zar Amir: I was filming in Armenia, so I couldn’t be there, unfortunately. But every evening, I followed the progress of the Games. The refugee judo team in Paris was in contact with me, and I was informed daily of what was happening. But there’s one image that particularly touched me, that of Kimia Alizadeh in Taekwondo for Bulgaria and Nahid Kiani, representing Iran, hugging each other. These two are friends, comrades. They found themselves in a similar situation again four years ago. Last time, Kimia won, and this time, Nahid did. That’s what’s beautiful. One was Iranian, the other was Bulgarian, but she was also Iranian. This image where they hug and hold each other for a long time was censored on Iranian national television. They (the regime) can’t even bear this friendship. That’s the subject of our film. Yes, that really touched me. It’s exactly what happens in “Tatami” at the end. Then, there was the first refugee in boxing to win a medal (Cindy Ngamba). This refugee team, which has only existed for three Olympiads (since 2016), is fabulous. It was a great event. “TATAMI” is not only inspired by Iranians but also by refugees worldwide. There are also other athletes who find themselves in similar situations as described in the film. Abandonment is sometimes a personal decision, or it’s the pressure of a state. I would like everyone to find peace, to preserve this friendship, and not let states break this bond. That’s what I wish for, but everyone has their opinion.
“During the Olympics, there was an image that particularly touched me:
Kimia Alizadeh in Taekwondo for Bulgaria and Nahid Kiani, representing Iran, hugging each other.”
Le Mag du Ciné: What’s also important is that in the film “Tatami,” we see that the Israeli and Iranian athletes are friends, they know each other, but there’s also a cultural proximity between the two countries. Even if it’s not detailed in the film, we feel a zone of conflict, a zone of tension. Were there any difficulties around production and shooting? Zar Amir: No, we took a lot of precautions on set. It was a very secure shoot. I didn’t go out because we were filming in Tbilisi, where there’s a significant Iranian community close to the government. There’s a whole network of businesses run by the Revolutionary Guards in Georgia. I was very careful. I didn’t go out. Fortunately, it was winter, so I was always a bit hidden behind my scarf. But the location helped us because it was a stadium where 80% of the shooting took place. We were locked in an underground area. There was security in place because we didn’t want to be disturbed by anyone, whether from the government or not. But what’s interesting is that when I started working on this film, I told the production that I would never set foot in Israel. And it’s not because I’m against Israel, but because I’ve heard so many stories from people, filmmaker friends, who were detained for hours and hours at the airport for questioning. I was interrogated in Iran for a year. I’m completely frustrated and traumatized by what I experienced there. Even when I go to the United States and get asked more than three questions in a slightly aggressive manner, I start shaking. So I couldn’t imagine spending an entire day at the airport. Finally, we started the editing. It was very complicated to edit remotely. At one point, I thought it wasn’t possible. For the sake of the film, I had to go to Tel Aviv. When I arrived in Tel Aviv, everyone at the airport was already aware. I passed through quite quickly, and I discovered Tel Aviv. The first impression I had was that I felt at home. I saw people and thought, "This is not possible, we could really be brothers and sisters, we are almost from the same family, the same culture." Even our flaws are similar (laughs). It’s funny, but honestly, even the food, the smell I like, I don’t know, the air, the architecture, everything pleased me. It was like I was in Iran. I met the entire Israeli team, and we laughed so much; we got along so well. Honestly, if we hadn’t been forced to speak English between us, it was as if I was with my Iranian friends; we have the same flaws (laughs). That’s why I wanted to tell this story. There was no problem, no dispute, nothing. We got along well with everyone.
“I discovered Tel Aviv. The first impression I had was that I felt at home.”
Movieintheair: We see very little of the actress who plays the Israeli athlete (Lir Katz), yet there’s an understanding between the two athletes. How did you manage to build this complicity? Zar Amir: They became best friends on set. From the first moments, they were inseparable. And our Israeli actress stayed for a long time. We wanted to see more of her on screen. But in the end, for reasons of subject sensitivity, we decided to slightly reduce her role, to focus more on the Iranian side. But their off-screen friendship worked so well that it’s felt on screen. Le Mag du Ciné: There’s a similar dilemma on both sides, with Leila on one side. How did you find the actress to play Leila? Zar Amir: We did a worldwide search. Le Mag du Ciné: Yes, because judo is at the center of the film. You needed people with the necessary physicality to portray these roles. Zar Amir: Yes, it was a long casting process. We met many actresses everywhere. She also had to be Iranian to speak Farsi, etc. Arienne lives in Los Angeles, in the same city as Guy (Guy Nattiv), but she comes from boxing. Physically, she was ready, but she didn’t know judo. She trained with a wonderful coach (Philippe Moretti, from Hollywood Judo Dojo, who just celebrated his 90th birthday) in Los Angeles for two or three months. And I was there for the Oscars campaign for "Holy Spider." As I spent a lot of time observing her, it helped me with my role as a coach. I saw how hard she worked every day for two and a half months. At the same time, she had to work on her Iranian attitude because she’s part of the generation that didn’t grow up in Iran. Her mother is Chilean. She didn’t speak Farsi well. But every night (during the day, Arienne Mandi was working on the series The L Word: Generation Q), we worked on her Farsi, but not just the language, also on the entire attitude, all the gestures that come from an Iranian girl, not a Los Angeles girl. She is strong, she is highly talented. All the other judokas were real Georgian judokas. We had a stunt double for her on set in case she couldn’t perform certain scenes. But she did everything herself, and these real judokas were amazed at how quickly she became a real judoka in just two months. The real judokas were there with their mouths open: "How did she manage to become a real judoka in two months?" She could have competed in the Olympics!
“We worked every night so that Arienne could embody
not only the character but also the attitude of a real Iranian young woman.”
Movieintheair: Regarding judo, we really feel the strength in this sport on screen. It’s a strength that’s both physical and internal. How did you work on the narrative level to convey this intensity on screen? Zar Amir: We talked a lot about it. It all rests on her; she is strong, she is highly talented, she is deep. We discussed a lot. Since she knew everything about Iran and its realities, I found connections and resources every night for her to better understand this culture and grasp what it means to put an entire family in jeopardy. What does it mean for a mother to see her son grow up, and what does this man represent to her? Because her husband embodies an entire new generation of men who have understood that women’s rights must be respected and supported. We talked a lot about all this. Before each scene, we reviewed the text together, discussing every moment, every emotion to convey. During the scene, I didn’t let go of anything, and from the beginning, she told me, "I have to work on judo, the Farsi accent, and the entire Iranian culture, but I just ask you not to hesitate to push me further. Don’t think I’m tired, even if I mess up." This generosity allowed me to work in complete tranquility with her. There were moments during the shoot where we would pause to resume a little discussion, just to adjust a hand movement or bring out a particular emotion, especially during the scene where she removes her veil. She fascinated me. Really, she grasped everything. Le Mag du Ciné: How did you work on this complicity? Did it seem easy for you in the end, with this interesting mirror effect between the two characters, where Maryam, in looking at Leila, perhaps sees herself when she was younger, with her doubts and unrealized dreams? Zar Amir: It was a whole process for me, this story of seeing oneself in the mirror of this determined youth that needed to be reworked in the script, and we did rework it. But I also tried to interpret that in my way of showing the hardness of this character. Maryam became tough because she went through hardships, she carried this baggage of regrets for years, and she even became jealous. For me, that’s what it was, she was truly a jealous woman. But especially when we talk about judo, this sport embodies an attitude, a mentality of respect. It’s not like boxing. You don’t try to hurt others. For me, Maryam could have been a judo champion; her foundation isn’t bad, but she consumed herself for years with this lie, betraying herself, and she suffered from it. Since Arienne was truly the best partner, it allowed us to create touching moments between us, even though I was also the director and she was the actress. It helped us create this relationship of respect between the coach and her judoka. It was joyful work. We even went back to shoot two more days for Maryam because there were still missing moments after the rewrite since the film needed to tell the story of these two women. Maryam remains a secondary character, but she’s so complex that it was difficult to find the right balance.
“Maryam remains a secondary character, but she’s so complex
that it was difficult to find the right balance.”
Le Mag du Ciné: What stands out at the end of all this is that there is still a form of sisterhood that ultimately saves them both. Zar Amir: She becomes a true coach, a true sister. Movieintheair: How did you manage to both act and direct at the same time? Wasn’t it too difficult to do both? Zar Amir: No, I’m somewhat used to doing everything on set. (laughs) Already during "Holy Spider," I wasn’t supposed to play the journalist. I was there to assist Ali Abbasi and coach the other actors. And I didn’t abandon those other roles when I started acting in the film (laughs). So it was exactly the same. I was constantly running behind the camera and in front of the camera. It was just a matter of time because the shoot was really tight, we only had 23 days of shooting, with a very small budget. There were many actors, a stadium with everything related to judo and all the judo scene rehearsals. We rehearsed judo scenes all day while maintaining the intensity of the performance, especially with the camera movements. When I played all the scenes outside the tatami, it was complicated because there wasn’t always time for me to act, watch what I had done, and then go back to acting. We often only did one take. I still took a very big risk. There was very little time to shoot a second take. So, I went in front of the camera well-organized, well-prepared for every movement. Movieintheair: Did you rehearse before the shoot? Zar Amir: Not really on set. But we talked a lot, me with the other actors as the director. I knew exactly what we were going to do. With Guy, we talked a lot about the camera. I knew how it was going to go. I acted, watched, checked that everything was fine, then we went back on set. Le Mag du Ciné: The camera is very important in this film. There are many long shots where we follow the characters through the corridors to the locker rooms, to the tatami, with back and forth movements. Even in silence, we can hear you walking, but we feel that something is working in the head, that something is being thought over. We wonder if she’s going to manage to keep a cool head? Zar Amir: We encountered many difficulties on the shooting location. We had our shot list, our breakdown, but on set, especially for the judo scenes, there was often a lack of light, and there were always problems to solve, as the stadium, a bit Soviet-like, was like a closed environment, without enough space to do everything. Le Mag du Ciné: Is that why you and Guy chose to shoot in black and white? Zar Amir: No, not at all, it was a decision made from the beginning. It was tied to the story of these two characters living in a black and white world, closed off, where they don’t really have a choice: either stay or leave. Movieintheair: Regarding the husband (played by Ash Goldeh), do you think it’s an optimistic or realistic vision that he supports his wife like that, that he stands by her with their child? Is it possible today? Zar Amir: Yes. That’s what I was saying. He represents a whole new generation of men who support their wives, as we saw during the women’s revolt in Iran two years ago. I even see it in cinema. There are quite a few Iranian directors who no longer want to shoot films depicting a false image of veiled women because that’s not the reality. Many men respect their wives, their decisions not to wear the veil, even if it puts the whole family at risk for such a personal decision as what to wear. Many women in various professions have been forced to leave Iran because they couldn’t stand the situation anymore, and their husbands have accompanied them. I think that yes, fortunately, things are changing a lot. Every day, mindsets are evolving even more. For me, Leila couldn’t do everything without the support of her husband and child. That’s what I believe. I’m not at all a feminist in an extreme sense. I think we can’t separate men from women. I believe that without men, we don’t exist, and without women, men don’t exist either. We can only succeed in moving forward, preserving our freedom if we live together; otherwise, it’s not possible. And that’s the story we tell in Tatami. Movieintheair: This is rather a hopeful film. Do you hope this film will help change mindsets? Are you hopeful? Zar Amir: I hope it will touch people. I hope this collaboration between an Israeli and an Iranian will inspire others, beyond these two peoples. Today, we see war everywhere, in every corner of the world, conflicts, and problems. I think this film will be seen by many people who will come out inspired. But beyond that, the story of friendship between these two women, these two generations, is really powerful.
“I hope this collaboration between an Israeli and an Iranian will inspire others,
beyond these two peoples.”
Movieintheair: Do you watch any films or series? Zar Amir: I don’t have time! But a few days ago, I started watching this documentary on Netflix, My Octopus Teacher.It takes place in South Africa; it’s incredible. But I fell asleep in the middle (laughs)… Movieintheair: What are your upcoming projects? Zar Amir: I have a film coming out soon in Angoulême in a week, « L’effacement » by Karim Moussaoui. I’m in the middle of writing and seeking funding for my next feature film (Honor of Persia). And I just finished filming a Franco-Armenian film (Sauver les morts) by Tamara Stepanyan, an Armenian director living in France, with Camille Cottin. Le Mag du Ciné: I noted Reading Lolita in Tehran. Zar Amir: Yes, it was shot last year. We are waiting for the release. It’s also directed by an Israeli, Eran Riklis. Le Mag du Ciné & Movieintheair: We look forward to seeing these films. We hope Tatami will be a great success and attract many viewers. Zar Amir: Thank you! We’re counting on you!
Tatami, by Guy Nattiv and Zar Amir
Synopsis: Iranian judoka Leila (Arienne Mandi) and her coach Maryam (Zar Amir) head to the World Judo Championships with the intention of bringing home Iran’s first gold medal. But during the competition, they receive an ultimatum from the Islamic Republic ordering Leila to fake an injury and withdraw to avoid a potential confrontation with the Israeli athlete.
With her freedom and that of her family at stake, Leila faces an impossible choice: comply with the Iranian regime, as her coach urges, or fight to achieve her dream.
Starring: Arienne Mandi (Leila Hosseini), Zar Amir (Maryam Ghanbari), Jaime Ray Newman (Stacey Travis), Nadine Marshall (Jean Claire Abriel), Lir Katz (Shani Lavi), Ash Goldeh (Nader Hosseini), Valeriu Andriuta (Vlad), Mehdi Bajestani (Amar Hosseini), Farima Habashizadehasi (Justina), Elham Erfani (Assistant Coach).
In theaters from September 4.
